the thriller in Manila!

...sigh, another in-flight interview

Full Transcript of Pope's Press Conference on Flight from Manila
America, The National Catholic Review
19 January 2015, 2:19PM
Gerard O'Connell 

 

THE FOLLOWING IS A FULL TRANSCRIPT IN ENGLISH OF THE POPE’S PRESS CONFERENCE (The translation is unofficial, and was done by the author and other colleagues aboard the papal flight)

Father Lombardi

Holy Father, thank you for being with us, we see you are in splendid form after these days of travel, and we thank you for giving us more work to do today as well, as your conversation will give us work for the duration of the trip. Before we put the question perhaps you would like to say something to us.

POPE:  First of all I greet you. Good day, thank you for your work.  It was challenging, and as we say in Spanish, “pasada per agua” (it rained on the parade).  It is beautiful, and I thank you very much for what you have done. 

WHAT DID YOU LEARN FROM THE FILIPINOS?

Lombardi: The first question will be from Kara David, who is part of the Filipino group.

Kara David (GMA Network):  Good day Holy Father. Sorry, I will speak in English. Thank you very much for visiting our country and for giving so much hope to the Filipinos. We would like you to come back to our country. My question is: the Filipinos have learned a lot from listening to your messages.  Is there something the Holy Father has learned from the Filipinos, from your encounter with us?

Pope: The gestures!  The gestures moved me. They are not protocol gestures, they are good gestures, felt gestures, gestures of the heart. Some almost make one weep.   There’s everything there: faith, love, the family, delusion, the future. That gesture of the fathers who think of their children so that the Pope will bless them. Not one gestures, there were fathers, there were many who thought of their children when we passed by on the road, a gesture which in other places one does not see, as if they say this is my treasure, this is my future, this is my love, for this one it’s worth working, for this one it’s worth suffering. A gesture that is original but born from the heart.

A second gesture that struck me very much is an enthusiasm that is not feigned, a joy, a happiness (allegria), a capacity to celebrate.  Even under the rain, one of the masters of ceremonies told me that he was edified because who were serving never lost the smile (on their face. It’s the joy,  not feigned joy.  It wasn’t a painted (false) smile. No, no!  It was a smile that just came, and behind that smile there is a normal life, there are pains, problems.

Then there were the gestures of the mothers who brought their sick children.  Indeed mothers in general bring them there, but usually mothers do not lift the children up so much, only up to here. The dads do, one sees them. Here dad! Then many disabled children, with disabilities that make some impression; they did not hide the children, they brought them to the Pope so that he would bless them.  This is my child, s/he is mine.  All mothers know this, they do this.  But it’s the way they did this that struck me.  The gesture of motherhood, of fatherhood, of enthusiasm, of joy.

There’s a word that’s difficult for us to understand because it has been vulgarized too much, used too badly, too badly understood, but it’s a word that has substance: resignation. A people who knows how to suffer, and is capable of rising up.

Yesterday, I was edified at the talk I had with the father of Kristel, the young woman volunteer who died in Tacloban.  He said she died in service, he was seeking words to confirm himself to this situation, to accept it. A people that knows how to suffer, that’s what I saw and how I interpreted the gestures.

2.  VISITS TO AFRICA

Jean Louis De La Vaissiere (AFP):  Holy Father, you have now gone twice to Asia. The Catholics of Africa have yet to receive a visit from you.  You know that from South Africa to Nigeria to Uganda many faithful who suffer from poverty, war, Islamic fundamentalism hope you will visit this year.  So I would like to ask you, when and where are you thinking of going?

POPE: I will respond hypothetically.  The plan is to go to the Central African Republic and Uganda, these two, this year.  I think that this will be towards the end of the year, because of the weather, no?  They have to calculate when there won’t be rains, when there won’t be bad weather.  This trip is a bit overdue, because there was the Ebola problem.  It is a big responsibility to hold big gatherings, contagion, no?  But in these countries there is no problem.  These two are hypothetical, but it will be this year.

3.  STATE TERRORISM AND THE THROWAY CULTURE

Lombardi:  Now we give the floor to our friend Izzo Salvatore, from the Italian information agency AGI.

Salvatore Izzo (AGI) :Holy Father, in Manila we were in a very beautiful hotel. Everyone was very nice and we ate very well, but as soon as you left this hotel you were, let's call it morally accosted, at least, by the poverty. We saw children among the trash, treated possibly I would say as refuse (themselves). Now, I have a son who is six years old and I was ashamed because they were in such poor conditions. I have a son Rocco who has understood very well what you are saying when you say to share with the poor. So on the way to school, he tries to distribute snacks to the beggars in the area. And, for me it's much more difficult. Also for others it's very difficult. Just one cardinal 40 years ago left everything to go among the lepers so, I’d like to know why it is so difficult to follow that example also for the cardinals? I also wanted to ask you something else. It's about Sri Lanka. There we saw all of the "favelas" on the way to the airport, they are shack supported against the tree. They practically live under the trees. Most are Tamils and they are persecuted. After the massacre of Paris, right after possibly A CALDO, you said there is an isolated terrorism and a state-sponsored terrorism. What did you mean by "state-sponsored terrorism"? For me that meant the discrimination and suffering of these people.

POPE:  Thank you.

IZZO: One more thing Holy Father, I wanted to tell you that my agency, AGI Italia  is turning 65 years old. So, without taking anything away from ANSA, but I wanted to let you know that we are working very hard in Asia, because with the tracks that Enrico Mattei left, AGI, makes collaborative agreements with modest agencies in Palestine, in Pakistan, in Algeria, in a lot of countries. We would also like your encouragement. There are around 20 agencies that are associated with us in developing countries.

POPE: When one of you asked me what message I was bringing to the Philippines, I said the poor. Yes, it's a message that Church today gives, also the message that you say of Sri Lanka, of the Tamil and discrimination, no? The poor, the victims of this throwaway culture. This is true. Today, they don’t just discard  the paper and what's left over. We throw away people. And discrimination is a way of throwing away, these people are discarded. And it comes to mind a bit the image of the castes, no? This can't go on. But today, throwing away seems normal. And you spoke of the luxurious hotel and then the shacks . In my diocese of Buenos Aires, there was all of the new area which is called Puerta Madero up to the train station and then the start of the "Villas Miserias," the poor. One after another. And in this part there are 36 luxurious restaurants. If you eat there, they take off your head. And here there is hunger. One next to the other. And we have the tendency to get used to this, no? To this that… yes, yes, we're here and there are those thrown away. This is poverty, I think the Church must give an example, a much greater example here, refusing every worldliness. Do we consecrated, bishops, priests, sisters, laity truly believe that the gravest sin and the gravest threat is worldliness. It's really ugly when you see a consecrated man, a man of the Church, a sister who is worldly. It's ugly. This is not the way of Jesus. It's the path of an ONG that is called "church" but this isn't the Church of Jesus, that "ONG."

Because the Church is not an ONG but another thing, but when a part of the Church becomes worldly, it becomes an ONG and ceases to be the Church. The Church is Jesus who died and is risen for our salvation and the witness – one is Christian if one follows Christ.

That scandal that you've said is true, yes. Scandal, but we Christians often cause scandal. We Christians scandalize. Whether we be priests or laity because the way of Jesus is difficult. It's true that the Church needs to strip itself. But you've made me think about this state terrorism . This throwing away is exactly like terrorism. I hadn't ever thought about it honestly but it makes me think. I don't know what to say to you but truly those are not caresses, truly. It's like saying "No, you no. You cannot." Or, when … it happened here in Rome that a homeless man had a stomach pain. Poor man. When you have stomach pain you go to the hospital, into the emergency response unit, and they give you an aspirin or something like that and then they give you an appointment for 15 days later. The he went to a priest, and the priest saw (his condition) and was moved and said I'll take you to the hospital but I want you to do me a favor.  When I start explaining what you have, you pretend to faint. That's what happened. (He was) an artist. He did it well. There was peritonitis! This man was discarded. He went out alone, he was discarded and he was dying. That parish priest was smart, he grasped the situation well. He was far away from worldliness, right? Can one think it was state terrorism? Yes, one can think that.

Thanks, congratulations for the agency.

4.  IDEOLOGICAL COLONIZATION, AND PAUL VI’S STANCE ON BIRTH CONTROL

Jan Christoph Kitzler (Bayerischer Rundfunk): I would like to return for a minute to the encounter you had with the families. You have spoken of  ideological colonization. Would you explain a bit more the concept? Also Paul VI, speaking of the "particular causes" that are important to in the family... Can you give an example of these particular cases and maybe say also if there is need to open the way, to have a corridor for these particular cases?

POPE: The ideological colonization. I'll only give you an example of what I saw 20 years ago, in '95. A Minister of Public Education had asked for a big loan to build schools for the poor, public schools. They gave the loan on condition that in the schools there would be a school book for children of a certain level, no? It was a well prepared book, where the theory of gender was taught. This woman needed the money but that was the condition. She was smart.  She said yes, and also made them give another book, of a different orientation. And so she succeeded. This is ideological colonization. They enter with an idea that has nothing to do with the people;  but with groups of people yes, but not with the people. It colonizes the people with an idea that wants to change a mentality or a structure.

During the Synod, the African bishops lamented this: certain loans on certain conditions. I only say that which I have seen.. Why do they say ideological colonization? Because they take a real need of the people to have an opportunity to enter and make themselves strong with the children. But this is not new, the dictators of the last century did the same. They came with their own doctrine. Think of the BalilLa (The Fascist Youth under Mussolini), think of the Hitler youth.

They colonized the people, but they wanted to do it. But how much suffering.  Peoples must not lose their freedom. A people has its culture, its history. Every people has its own culture.

But when conditions are imposed by the colonizing empires they seek to make peoples forget their own identity and make them (all) equal. This is the globalization of the sphere -- all the points are equidistant from the center. But the true globalization – and I like to say this - is not the sphere. It is important to globalize but not like the sphere, but like the polyhedron. Namely that every people, every part, conserves its own identity without being ideologically colonized. These are the ideological colonizations.

There is a book, excuse me but I'll make commercial, there is a book that maybe is a bit heavy at the beginning because it was written in 1903 in London. It is a book that at that time, the writer had seen this drama of the ideological colonization and wrote in that book, it is called "The Lord of the Earth" or the other title "The Lord of the World." One of those. The author is Benson, written in 1903. But I advise you to read it, and reading it you will understand what I mean by ‘ideological colonization’.

On Paul VI:  It’s true that openness to life is a condition for the sacrament of matrimony. A man cannot give the sacrament to the woman, and the woman cannot give it to him, if they are not in accord on this point of openness to life. If it can be proved that he or she married with the intention of not being Catholic (on this point) then the matrimony is null. (It is) a cause for the annulment of the marriage, no? Openness to life.

Paul VI had studied this with the commission for life, what to do to help  many cases, many problems, no? The important problems that make for the love of life;  the problems of every day -- but many, many.

But there was something more. The refusal of Paul VI was not only about the personal problems, that he  then tells the confessors to be merciful, to understand if this is true, and then (he tells them) “you can be merciful, more understanding”.  He was looking at the Neo-Malthusianism that was underway worldwide. What do you call this Neo-Malthusianism?  Less than one percent of birth rate in Italy. The same in Spain. That Neo-Malthusianism that seeks to control humanity on behalf of the powers (that be).

This does not mean that the Christian must make children in series. I rebuked a woman some months ago in a parish who was pregnant eight times, with seven C-sections (cesareans). “But do you want to leave seven orphans?  That is to tempt God!  (Paul VI) speaks of responsible parenthood. What I wanted to say was that Paul VI was not antiquated, close minded. No,(he was) a prophet again who with this (encyclical) told us to  watch out for the Neo-Malthusianism that is coming. This is what I wanted to say.

5  FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION AND THE NEED FOR PRUDENCE

Lombardi:  Thanks Holy Father. I now give the question to Valentina, but I would like to draw your attention to the fact that we are now over China, we seem to have now become accustomed to holding press conferences over China, as we did returning from Korea.

Valentina ALazraki Crastich (Televisa):  On the flight from Sri Lanka you used the image of the response that this poor man (Alberto Gasbarri, organizer of papal trips) might have merited if he insulted your mother. Your words were not well understood by everyone in the world and seemed to justify in some way the use of violence in the face of provocation. Could you explain a little better what you meant to say?

Pope: In theory we can say that a violent reaction in the face of an offense or a provocation, in theory yes, it is not a good thing, one shouldn’t do it.   In theory we can say what the Gospel says, that we should turn the other cheek.  In theory we can say that we have freedom of expression, and that’s important. But in theory we all agree.  But we are human and there’s prudence which is a virtue of human coexistence.  I cannot constantly insult, provoke a person continuously because I risk making him/her angry, and I risk receiving an unjust reaction, one that is not just.  But that’s human. For this reason I say that freedom of expression must take account of the human reality and for this reason one must be prudent. It’s a way of saying that one must be educated, prudent.   Prudence is the virtue that regulates our relations. I can go up to here,  I can go up to there, and there, beyond that no.  What I wanted to say is that in theory we all agree: there is freed of expression, a violent aggression is not good, it’s always bad. We all agree, but in practice let us stop a little because we are human and we risk to provoke others. For this reason freedom must be accompanied by prudence. That’s what I wanted to say.

6. POPE IN THE USA, LATIN AMERICA, THE CANONISATION OF JUNIPERO SERRA AND BEATIFICATION OF ARCHBISHOP ROMERO

Nicole Winfield (AP): Could you tell us about your visit to the USA and which cities you will visit, and whether you will go to California for the canonization of Junipero Serra, or go to the border with Mexico? Also which Latin American countries will you visit, and do you intend to preside over the beatification ceremony of Archbishop Romero?

 POPE:  I will start with the last part. There will be a war between Cardinal Amato and Monsignor Paglia (laughs) over which of the two will do the beatification. No, personally (speaking), the beatifications are normally done by the Cardinal of the dicastery or someone else.

Let’s go the first (question) about (the visit to)the United States. The three cities are Philadelphia, for the meeting of families; New York, I have the date already but I can’t remember, for the visit the UN,

And Washington. It is these three.

I would like to go to California for the Canonization of Junipero (fr. Junipero Serra), but I think there is the problem of time. It requires two more days.

I think that I will do that canonization at the national Shrine (the national Shrine  of the Immaculate Conception) in Washington, It is a national event. In Washington, (I’m not sure where) there is a statue of Junipero at the Capitol where there is the statue of Abraham Lincoln.

Then to enter the USA from the border of Mexico would be a beautiful thing, as a sign of brotherhood and of help to the immigrants. But you know that go to Mexico without going to visit the Madonna (of Guadalupe) would be a drama . A war could break out (laughing)

And then this would mean 3 more days, and this is not clear. So I think there will only be those three cities. Later there will be time to go to Mexico.

Did I forget something?

Latin America countries?

We have foreseen for this year – everything is still in draft (form) -- Ecuador, Bolivia and Paraguay. These three.

Next year God willing, but everything is still in draft, I would like to go to  Chile, Argentina and Uruguay. Peru’ is missing there, but we don’t know where to put it.

Father Lombardi: Thank you. We already have quite a precise program of the  (Pope’s) travels.  Everything is provisional (this is just a draft schedule) – nothing is decided yet.

7. CORRUPTION IN GOVERNMENTS AND THE CHURCH

Jhemmyrlrut Teng ( TVS Network Inc)  What can your holiness do to fight corruption not just in governments but maybe in the Church as well?

Pope:   That’s a tough one, eh?  Corruption is the order of the day in today’s world, and the corrupt attitude easily and immediately finds a nest in the institutions, because an institution that has many branches here and there, so many chiefs and vice-chiefs, in this way it’s very easy for it to fall or provide a nest for corruption and every institution can fall into this. Corruption is taking from the people. The corrupt person who does corrupt deals or governs corruptly or associates himself with others in order to do corrupt deals robs the people. The victims are those -- where is he, the one with the (AGI) anniversary? -- they are those who you said were behind the luxury hotel, no? They are the victims of corruption. Corruption is not closed in on itself; it goes out and kills. Do you understand? Today corruption is a worldwide problem. Once, in 2001 more or less, I asked the chief of the cabinet of the president at that time, which was a government that we thought to be not so corrupt - and it was true, it was not so corrupt, the government: “Tell me, the aid that you send into the interior of the country, whether it be in cash or food or clothes, all these things, how much gets to the place.” Immediately this man, who is a true man, clean, (said), “35 percent.” That’s what he told me. That was in 2001 in my homeland. And now, corruption in ecclesial institutions. When I speak of the Church I like to speak of the faithful, the baptized, the whole church, no? In that case, it’s better to speak of sinners. We are all sinners, no? But when we speak of corruption, we speak either of corrupt persons or of institutions in the church that fall into corruption. And there are such cases, yes, there are. I remember once, in the year 1994, when I had been scarcely named bishop of the Flores quarter of Buenos Aires, two employees or functionaries of a ministry came to me to tell me, “You have so much need here with so many poor in the villas miserias (shanty towns).” “Oh yes,” I said, and they told me “We can help you. We have, if you want, a subsidy of 400,000 pesos.” At that time, the exchange rate with the dollar was one to one. $400,000. “You can do that?” “Yes, yes.” I listened because, when the offer is so big, even the saint is challenged. And they went on: “To do this, we make the deposit and then you give us half for ourselves.” In that moment I thought about what I would do: either I insult them and give them a kick where the sun never shines or I play the fool. I played the fool and said, in truth, we at the vicariate don’t have an account; you have to make the deposit at the archdiocese’s office (chancery) with the receipt. And that was it. “Oh, we didn’t know.” And they left. But later I thought, if these two landed without even asking for a runway -- it’s a bad thought -- it’s because someone else said yes. But it’s a bad thought, no?

Does corruption happen easily? Let’s remember this: sinners yes, corrupt no, never corrupt. We must ask pardon for those Catholics, those Christians who scandalize with their corruption. It’s a wound in the church. But there are so many saints, so many saints. And sinner saints, but not corrupt. Let’s look at the other side, too, the church is holy. There are some here and there. Thank you for having the courage to ask this question.

8.  CHINA QUESTION

Anais Feuga (Radio France): We’ve flying over China. Coming back from Korea, you said you’re ready to go to China tomorrow. In the light of this declaration, can you explain why you didn’t receive the Dalai Lama when he was at Rome a little while ago, and where do relations with China stand?

Pope: Thanks for asking me this question. It’s a habit in the protocol of the Secretariat of State not to receive heads of state and people at that level when they’re taking part in an international meeting here in Rome. For example, for FAO (the Food and Agricultural Organization of the United Nations) I didn’t receive anyone. That’s the reason he wasn’t received. I saw that some newspapers said I didn’t receive him out of fear of China. That’s not true. At that time, this [protocol] was the reason. He asked for an audience, and it was said … but a date, a certain point, he had this before but not for this moment, we are in contact. The motive was not a refusal of a person, or fear of China. Yes, we’re open, we want peace with everyone …

How do the relations with China stand? The government of China is respectful (educated), we’re respectful (educated), let’s take things one step at a time. That’s how things are done in history, no? We don’t yet know, but they know that I’m available either to receive [someone] or to go [to China].

9.  RESPONSE FROM MODERATE MUSLIMS TO POPE’S APPEAL

Marco Ansaldo (La Repubblica):  When you were in Turkey you asked the leaders in the Muslim world – political, religious and accademics – to take a stance against terrorism when acts of terrorism happen. It seems your appeal has not been heard by the top levels of moderate Islam. .

Pope:  There’s also the appeal that I repeated the very day that I left for Sri Lanka, (the appeal) that I made in my speech to the diplomatic corps that morning.  In the speech to the diplomatic corps I said – I don’t remember the exact words – that the religious, political, academic and intellectual leaders express themselves. Also the people, the moderate Islamic world, asks this from its leaders. Some of them have done something. I believe we have to give them a little more time,because for them the situation is not easy.  And I have the hope, because there are many good people among them,.  I am sure that it will arrive.  I wanted to say the same that I repeated on the date of the departure.

10.CHURCH’S RESPONSE TO CRITICISM OF ITS STANCE ON BIRTH CONTROL

Christoph Schmidt (CIC): How does the Church respond to the criticisms about its position on birth control given that the world population is growing so much. And to the criticism that the poverty in the Philippines is due to the fact that Filipino women have an average of 3 children each?

POPE:  I think the number of 3 (children) per family that you mentioned, it is the one experts say is important to keep the population going,. three per couple. When it goes below this, the other extreme happens, like what is happing in Italy. I have heard, I do not know if it is true, that in 2024 there will be no money to pay pensioners (because of) the fall in population.

Therefore, to give you an answer, they key word is the one the Church always uses all the time and even I use it: it is responsible parenthood. how do we do this? With dialogue. Each person  with his pastor seeks how to do that responsible parenthood .

 That example i mentioned shortly before about that woman who was expecting her eighth (child) and already had seven who were born with caesareans.  That is an irresponsibility (That woman might say) 'no but I trust in god'  But God gives you methods to be responsible. Some think that, excuse me if i use that word, that in order to be good Catholics we have to be like rabbits. No. Responsible parenthood! This is clear and that is why in the church there are marriage groups, there are experts in this matter, there are pastors, one can seek and i know so many, many ways out that are licit and that have helped this. you did well to ask me this  

Another thing in relation to this is that for the most poor people, a child is a treasure. It is true that you have to be prudent here too but for them a child is a treasure. (Some would say) 'God knows how to help me' and perhaps some of them are not prudent, this is true. Responsible paternity but let us also look at the generosity of that father and mother that see a treasure in every child.   

11. MOST MOVING MOMENTS IN THE PHILIPPINES-

Elisabetta Pique (La Nacion): Representing the Spanish language group, I have two questions.  This was a moving voyage for everyone. We saw people crying the entire time in Tacloban, even we journalists cried.  Yesterday you said, the world needs to cry.  We would like to ask you, what was – and it was all very moving – what was for you the most moving moment, because the mass in Tacloban was such a moment and also yesterday when the little girl started to cry.  That is the first question, what was for you the moment. The second, yesterday you made history, you surpassed the record set by John Paul II, in the same place, there were 6 or 7 million people.  How does it feel to have seen - Cardinal Tagle was telling us that during the mass in front of the altar you asked him, but how many people are here?  How does it feel to have surpassed this record, to have entered into history as the Pope with the mass with the highest attendance in history?  Thank you. 

Pope: The most moving moment…For me the mass in Tacloban was very moving. Very moving.  To see all of God’s people standing still, praying, after this catastrophe, thinking of my sins and those people, it was moving, a very moving moment.  In the moment of the mass there, I felt as though I was annihilated (“wiped out”), I almost couldn’t speak. I felt very little  I don’t know what happened to me, maybe it was the emotion, I don’t know.  But I didn’t feel another thing, it was quite something. And then the gestures were moving.  Every gesture.  When I passed and a father would make this (gesture)  and I blessed him, he would say thank you but…for them, a blessing was enough.  I thought, but I who have so many expectations, I want this and I want that. This was good for me, no?  Moving moments.  After I found out that in Tacloban we landed with winds at 70 miles per hour, I took seriously the warning that we needed to leave no later than one o’clock  because there was a danger. But I wasn’t afraid.

As for the great turnout, I felt annihilated.  These were God’s people, and God was present, and the joy of the presence of God which tells us - think on it well -that you are servants of these people, they are the protagonists. Something like this. 

The other thing is the weeping.  One of the things that is lost when there is too much wealth or when values are misunderstood or we have become accustomed to injustice, to this culture of waste,  is the capacity to cry.  This is a grace we must ask for.  There is a beautiful prayer in the ancient missal, for crying.  It went more or less like this:  Lord, you who have made it so that Moses with his cane could make water flow from a stone, make it so that from the rock that is my heart, the water of tears may flow.   It’s a beautiful prayer.  We Christians must ask for the grace to cry, especially well-to-do Christians.  And cry about injustice and cry about sins.   Because crying opens you to understand new realities, or new dimensions to realities.  This is what the girl said, what I said to her.  She was the only one to ask that question to which there is no answer, why do children suffer?.  The great Dostoyevsky asked himself this, and he could not answer.  Why do children suffer?  She, with her weeping, a woman who was weeping.  When I say it is important that women be held in higher consideration in the church, it’s not just to give them a function as the secretary of a disaster, though this could be ok  too.  No, it’s so that they may tell us how they feel and view reality.  Because women view things from a different richness, a larger one.  Another thing I would like to underscore is what I said to the last young man (at the meeting with young people), who truly works well, he gives and gives and gives, he organizes to help the poor.   But don’t forget that we too need to be beggars, from them, from the poor.  Because the poor evangelize us.  If we take the poor away from the Gospel, we cannot understand Jesus’ message. The poor evangelize us.  I go to evangelize the poor, yes, but let you be evangelized by them.  Because they have values that you do not. 

POPE  THANKS THE MEDIA  

I thank you very much for work, I have esteem for it.  Thanks very much.  I know it is a sacrifice for you.  Thanks very much.  I would like make these thanks concrete towards our deaconess,  whose birthday it is today.  We can’t say how old you are but you’ve worked here since you were a child, as a child, as a child.  Best wishes.

 

Yes, another in-flight interview Colombo to Manila

Francis looses his zucchetto while exiting the jet in Manila.

Francis is consistent. He talks about the same stuff over and over and over. One statement he recently said, in an interview to Elisabetta Pique must have his sycophants in a tizzy.

"I’m constantly making statements, giving homilies. That’s magisterium. That’s what I think, not what the media say that I think. Check it out; it’s very clear. "

Straight from Francis mouth, all those off-the-cuff interviews and sermons in which he has said many un-Catholic remarks and taught heresy are according to him are magisterium!

Concise Catholic Dictionary (1943)

Enjoy or cringe as you read and ponder upon Francis' latest teachings.

“Killing in the name of God is an aberration. But insulting religions is wrong”

ANDREA TORNIELLI

ON THE FLIGHT FROM COLOMBO TO MANILA

La Stampa's Vatican Insider

The Paris attacks, freedom of expression, responsibility: On the flight from Sri Lanka to the Philippines Pope Francis responded to a question put to him by a French journalist, regarding the debate that has flared up around the cruel massacre of Charlie Hebdo’s cartoonists. The Pope explained that “reacting with violence is not right,” in fact, “killing in the name of God is an aberration”. But as far as the freedom of expression goes, “there is a limit”. Using the example of an insult made against one’s mother, it seemed the Pope was trying to say that when you touch what is most dear to a person, you can end up unleashing all sorts of rash reactions.

FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION AND RELIGION

I think that both religious freedom and the freedom of expression are fundamental human rights. Let’s be frank, take Paris! One thing is true: each person has the right to practice their own religion freely, without causing offence to others. And that is what we all want.  Secondly, offending or waging war, killing in the name of one’s own religion, in the name of God, is not right. We are shocked by what is happening now, but let us think back to our history, how many religious wars have been fought! Think of the [Massacre] of St. Bartholomew (when Huguenots were killed by Catholics, Ed.). As you see, we also committed such sins but killing in the name of God is not right, it is an aberration. [Religion must be practiced] freely but without causing offence.

Regarding freedom of expression: not only does each person have the freedom and the right to say what they think for the common good, they have a duty to do so. If a member of parliament does not say what they think is the right path to take, they do not benefit the common good. So people must have this freedom but they must not cause offence, because while it is true that it is wrong to react with violence, if Mr. Gasbarri, who is a friend, insults my mother, that’s asking for a punch. Provoking and insulting other people’s faiths is not right. In one of his speeches (the Regensburg lecture delivered in 2006, Ed.), Pope Benedict XVI spoke of this post-positivist mentality, of a post-positivist metaphysics that led people to believe that religions or religious expressions are a kind of subculture. They are tolerated but they boil down to little, they are not part of a culture of enlightenment. And this is a legacy of the enlightement. So many people badmouth, make fun of and mock othe rpeople’s religions. They provoke and in doing so could get the kind of reaction Mr. Gasbarri would get if he said something bad about my mother. There is a limit, every religion has its dignity. I cannot mock a religion that respects human life and the human person. I used this example about limits to illustrate that freedom of expression has its limits, as in the example I gave of my mother.

MY SAFETY? I’M CONCERNED ABOUT THE SAFETY OF FAITHFUL

“The best way to react (to threats, Ed.) is with moderation, being moderate, humble, kind, without being aggressive. I am concerned about faithful, I really am, anbd I have spoke to Vatican security about this: Mr. Giani (the chief of Vatican police, Ed.) is on board this flight and he is in charge of this, he is well informed. I am quite concerned about this. But you know I have one weakness, I am quite reckless. Sometimes I ask myself: what if it happened to me? I have simply asked the Lord for the grace of not letting me come to harm because I am not courageous in the face of pain, I am very fearful.”

KAMIKAZES AND CHILDREN

“Perhaps I am being disrespectful, but I am inclined to say that behind every suicide attack there is an element of human imbalance, I don’t know whether it is a mental imbalance but it is human. There is something that is not quite right with that person, that person has an imbalance in their life. They give their life but they do not give it in a good way. There are so many people who work, like the missionaries for example: they give their life, but in order to build something. Suicide killers, on the other hand, give their life in order to destroy. There is something not right here. I supervised a dissertation on Japanese kamikazes written by an Alitalia pilot. I was correcting the method part but the phenomenon is not understood fully and it is not only an Eastern phenomenon, it is linked to totalitarian and dictatorial systems that destroy life or the posibility of a future. But as I said before, this is not an exclusively Eastern phenomenon. Regarding the use of children in attacks (here the Pope was referring to young female suicide killers in Nigeria and the shocking video of the little boy who was filmed killing an IS victim Ed.): they are used everywhere for so many things, they are exploited at work, used as slaves and sexually abused. Some years ago some members of the Argentinean senate and I wanted to launch a campaign in top hotels to announce that in those hotels children were not exploited to serve tourists, but we were not able to… On the occasions I visited Germany I sometimes came across articles that talked about sex tourism in parts of South-East Asia and this involved children as well. Children are also used in suicide attacks. I dare not say more.”

ANOTHER INTERRELIGIOUS MEETING IN ASSISI

“It was suggested that another interreligious meeting against violence be held in Assisi. I know that some are working on this. I spoke to Cardinal Tauran and I know it is an issue that other religions are also concerned about.”

THE POPE’S VISIT TO THE BUDDHIST TEMPLE

“The monk who is in charge of the temple managed to get himself an invitation from the government to go to the airport. He is also a good friend of Cardinal Ranjith’s and when he greeted me he asked me to visit the temple. I spoke to the cardinal but there wasn’t enough time. When I arrived, I had to cancel my meeting with the bishops because I wasn’t feeling too well, after the 29-kilometre journey I was exhausted. When I got back from Madhu yesterday the opportunity presented itself. I telephoned and made my way there. The temple holds the relics of two of Buddha’s disciples. They had been in England before and the monks managed to have them returned to them. He came to the airport and I went to see him at home. Then, yesterday, I saw something I never expected to see in Madhu: there were not only Catholics there but also Buddhists, Muslims and Hindus. All of them go there to pray and they say they receive graces. Among the people, who are never wrong, there is something that unites them and if they are united in such a natural way as to go and pray together in a temple that is Christian but not only… How could I not go to the Buddhist temple? What happened at Madhu is very important, it reflected the sense of interreligiosity experienced in Sri Lanka. There are some fundamentalist groups but they are not with the people, they are theological elites… People may have once said that Buddhists went to hell but so did Protestants. When I was a child we were taught that they went to hell. I remember my first experience of ecumenism: I was four or five years old and I was walking along with my grandmother who was holding my hand. On the other pavement there were two women from the Salvation Army wearing that hat which they no longer wear and the bow. ‘Are those nuns granny?’ I asked. To which she replied: ‘No, they are Protestants, but they are good!’ That was the first time I heard someone speaking well of people who belonged to different religions. The Church’s respect for other religions has grown a great deal, the Second Vatican Council spoke about respect for their values. There have been dark times in the history of the Church, we must not be ashamed to say so because we are also on a journey, this interreligiosity is a gift.”

THE NEW ENCYCLICAL

“I don’t know if humans who mistreat nature are fully responsible for climate change but they are largely responsible for it. We have taken hold of nature, of mother Earth, to some extent. An elderly farmer once said to me: God forgives always, sometimes he forgives humans but he never forgives nature. We have exploited nature too much. I remember hearing bishops at Aparecida (at the meeting held by Latin American episcopates in 2007, Ed.) speak about deforestation in the Amazon, I didn’t really understand much. Then, five years ago, a human rights commission and I sent out an appeal to stop a terrible deforestation project in northern Argentina. Then there is the one-crop system: farmers know that after cultivating wheat for three years they have to change the crop type for a year to regenerate the soil. Today soy crops are cultivated until the soil is depleted. Mankind has gone overboard. Thankfully today a lot of people are talking about this and I would like to remind you of my beloved brother Bartholomew (the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople, Ed.) who has written a great deal on this topic and I have read a lot of what he has written to prepare my encyclical. The theologian Romano Guardini talked about a second “inculture”, which is when you take possession of creation, turning culture into “inculture”. Cardinal Turkson and his team have presented the first draft of the new encyclical. I then worked on this and now I have prepared the third draft which I have sent to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the Secretariat of State and the theologian of the Papal Household so that they can make sure I am not talking nonsense. I will be taking a whole week off in March to finish it. I twill then be translated. I think that if all goes well, it should be out by June-July. The important thing is to ensure that there is an interval between its publication and the next climate meeting in Paris. I was disappointed by the last conference held in Peru. Let’s hope they are a bit more courageous in Paris. I think this is another issue that needs to be discussed with other religions and it is important for there to be an agreement based on a common feeling. I have talked about this with representatives of other religions and at least two theologians have already done this: it will not, however, be a common declaration, meetings with religions will come later.”

THE THEMES OF THE PAPAL VISIT TO THE PHILIPPINES

“There is a risk of simplifying things here but the crux of the message will be the poor. The poor who want to move forward, the poor who suffered the effects of Typhoon Yolanda and are still suffering its consequences, the poor who have faith and hope. The people of God, the poor, the poor who are exploited by those who bring about so many social, spiritual and existential injustices. At home in St. Martha’s House the other day, the Ethiopians celebrated and invited about fifty or so members of staff. I was there with them and I looked at the Filipinos who had left their country, their fathers, mothers and children behind to come here to work… the poor. This is going to be the focus of this visit.”

TRUTH AND RECONCILIATION IN SRI LANKA

“I do not really know what the truth commissions in Sri Lanka are like. I became familiar with the one in Argentina and I supported it because it was on a good path. I cannot say anything more specific. What I can say is that I support all balanced efforts to help facilitate mutual agreement. I heard the President of Sri Lanka say this: I would not want mine to be seen as a political comment. He told me he wants to push on with the work being done to promote peace and reconciliation. He then mentioned another word. He said: harmony needs to be created among the people. Harmony is more than peace and reconciliation, it is also musical. He added that this harmony will bring us happiness and joy. I was struck by this and I said: ‘it is good to hear this but it is not easy!’ To which he replied: ‘well yes, we have to get to people’s hearts.’ This makes me think before I answer: only by reaching the hearts of the people who know what injustice and the suffering inflicted by dictatorship is. Only by reaching people’s hearts can we find the right paths without compromises. The truth commissions are one of the elements that can be of help here but there are also other elements that help us achieve peace, reconciliation, harmony and to reach people’s hearts. I have borrowed the words used by Sri Lanka’s President.”

FR. VAZ AND THE NEW CANONIZATIONS

“These were what we call equivalent canonizations: when a man or a woman have been blesseds for a long period of time and they are venerated as saints by the people of God, then the miracle process is skipped. I did this for Angela da Foligno and I also chose to canonize  men and women who were great evangelisers. The first was Peter Fabre, a European evangeliser who died in the streets, evangelising. Then there were Canada’s evangelisers who founded the local Church. Then there was the Brazilian saint who founded São Paulo and now José Vaz, evangeliser of old Ceylon. In September I will canonize Junipero Serra in the United States. All these figures were powerful evangelisers and are in tune with the spirituality of the Evangelii Gaudium. 

or Gerard O'Connell's version of the in-flight interview from America, the National Catholic Review, 15 January 2015.

Full text in English of the Pope’s Press Conference on Flight from Colombo to Manila

POPE’S PRESS CONFERENCE:

Father Lombardi. Holy Father, welcome and thanks for being with us in this intermediate journey. Compliments for the first part of the trip which was accomplished so brilliantly. Now we will ask you a number of questions as usual. When you are tired and want to stop you will tell us, and go. 

Pope: I am already tired! (Laughs).. 

Lombardi: To start, I know that there is something very close to your hear that you wish to say to us regarding the significance of the canonization of Saint Joseph Vaz. Please tell us now so that we can receive this important message. Then we will go to the questions. We have various people already on the list.

Pope: This canonization was made with the methodology that is envisaged in the Church Law, it is called equipollent canonization. It is used when after a long time a man or woman is blessed (has been beatified) and has the veneration of the People of God, and de facto s/he is venerated as a saint, and the process of a miracle is not made. They are persons who can be that way perhaps for centuries. For this reason I did… the one who came first was Angela of Foligno, and then I choose to do persons who were great evangelizers (men or women). The first was Peter Faber who was the evangelizer of Europe. He died, one could say, on the road; he died travelling from place to place, evangelizing; he died at 40 years of age. And then came the others, the great evangelizers of Canada: Francis della Valle, Maria della Incarnacion. These two were practically the founders of the Church in Canada, he as a bishop, she as a nun, with all the apostolate they did there. Then there was Jose de Argueta, Brazil, the founder of San Paolo, who was for a long time a blessed, he is a saint. Then came Joseph Vaz, the evangelizer here of the Sri Lanka way back . And now in September, God willing, I will do the canonization of Blessed Junipero Serra in the United States. He was the evangelizer of the West in the United States. So these are persons (personalities) that did great evangelization, and so they are in accord with the theology of Evangelii Gaudium, and for this reason I choose these people. That’s it.

Lombardi: Now we move onto the questions, for which some of our colleagues are on the list. The first is Gerry O’Connell of America magazine whom you know well, I give him the floor. 

O’Connell: First of all Holy Father, I agree with Fr Lombardi. Congratulations for the good result of your visit to Sri Lanka. I ask a question on behalf of the English group. We have agreed to make “a bridge question” that links your visit in Sri Lanka to that in the Philippines.

We have seen the beauty of nature in Sri Lanka, but also the vulnerability of this island to the climatic changes, to the sea, and so on. We are now going to the Philippines, and you will visit the zone that has already been hit. You have been studying already for a year the question of ecology, care of creation and so on. There are three aspects to my question. First, is climate change mostly due to the work of man and his lack of care for nature? Second, when will your encyclical come? Third, you insist very much, as we have seen in Sri Lanka, on cooperation between the different religions, do you intend to invite the other religions to come together to face this problem ?

Pope: Thank you Gerry! The first question: you have used a word that frees me, the precision “mostly.” I don’t know if all, but “mostly,” for the greater part, it is man who gives a slap to nature continually, and we have to some degree become the owners of nature, of sister earth, of mother earth. I recall, and you have heard, what an old peasant once told me: God always forgives, we men forgive sometimes, but nature never forgives. If you give her a slap, she will give you one. I believe that we have exploited nature too much, deforestation, for example. I recall Aparecida, at that time I did not understand well this problem and when I heard the Brazilian bishops speak of the deforestation of the Amazonia, I ended up understanding well. Amazonia are the lungs of the world. Then five years ago, together with a commission for human rights, I made an appeal to the Supreme Court of Argentina to stop, at least temporarily, a terrible deforestation in a zone of Argentina, Tartagal, north of Salta. That’s one thing. Then there is the monoculture in agriculture. The peasants know that if you made a cultivation of corn three years in a row then you have to stop and do another (kind of) cultivation for one or two years to nitrogenize ( I don’t know the word exactly, ‘nitrogenizar’ we say in Spanish) the land so that it grows. Among us (in Argentina) there is cultivation of soya, and they make soya until the land is exhausted. Not all do this, it’s an example, and there are many more.

I believe that man has gone too far. Thanks be to God that there are voices (that speak about this), many, many. At this moment I would like to recall my beloved brother Bartholomew (Patriarch of Constantinople) who for years, for years, has preached about this. I read many things of his to prepare for this encyclical. I could go back on this, but I don’t want to be long. Guardini, and I only say this, used a word that explains a lot. The word that he says is the second manner of inculture is qualitative. The first is the inculture that we receive with creation to make it culture but when you become proprietor of it so much you go too far and this culture goes against you. Think of Hiroshima: an inculture is created, the second one.

The encyclical: the first draft was made by Cardinal Turkson with his team, then, with the help of some people, I took that (draft) and I worked on it. And then with some theologians I made a third (draft) and I sent this to the (Congregation of ) the Doctrine of the Faith and to the Second Section of the Secretariat of State, and to the theologian of the Pontifical Household so that they study it well, because I don’t want to say silly things. Three weeks ago I received the replies; some of them were thick like this, all were constructive. And now I will take a whole week in March to finish it. Then by the end of March it will be finished, and it will go for translation. And if the work of translation goes well – Monsignor Becciu (the Substitute in the Secretariat of State) is listening to me, he has to help in this. Then in June or July it can be published. It is important that there is some time between the publication of the encyclical and the meeting in Paris, because it is (intended) to be a contribution to that. The meeting in Peru was not such a great thing, it disappointed me, and there was a lack of courage. They stopped at a certain point. So let’s hope that at Paris they will be more courageous and that the representatives can go forward on that.

And the third (part of the question): yes, I believe the dialogue between the religions is important and on this point they – the other religions, understand well (the issue). And on this point there is agreement to listen as well. It’s not in the encyclical, the dialogue. But in fact I heard from some (people) of the other religions on this (subject), and I know that Cardinal Turkson did so. I know that at least two theologians did so for me, and this will be the road. There will not be a common declaration, the meetings will come afterwards.

Lombardi: Thanks Holy Father, and now we give the floor to Pia of the Philippine group. She will speak in English and it will be translated.

Pia: Holy Father, the Philippines will be very happy to meet you in a few hours. My question: What is your message to the thousands of people who will not be able to see you personally, even if they want to?

Pope: To respond to this I run the risk of being too simple. But I will say a word. The nucleus of the message will be the poor, the poor who want to go ahead, the poor who have suffered the typhoon Yolanda (Haiyan) and still suffer the consequences. The poor who have faith, (who have) hope and in this (there is) the commemoration of the five hundredth centenary of the preaching of the Gospel in the Philippines. The People of God in the Philippines, the poor (who are) exploited, those who suffer so many social, spiritual and existential injustices, Going to the Philippines I think of them. Some days ago we had a celebration in Santa Marta for the feast of the Nativity which is celebrated on the 7^th (January) by the Oriental Churches. There were three persons of Ethiopian nationality and some Filipinos who work there. The Ethiopians held a festive celebration and invited all the employees, some 50 of them, to lunch. I was with them, and I was looking at the Filipino workers and (thinking) how they had left their homeland seeking to be better off, leaving their dads, their moms, their children to make something better. Poor people! The essence of the message will be that.

Lombardi: Thank you. The next one is Juan Vincente Bo for ABC who asks a question on behalf of the Spanish group.

Bo: Holy Father for one who is tired you look very well! I want to ask you on behalf of the Spanish group on the history of Sri Lanka and the contemporary history.

During the years of the war in Sri Lanka there were over 300 kamikaze attacks, suicide attacks, made by men and women, and even children. Now we are seeing suicide attacks on the part of young men and women, and even children. What do you think of this method of waging war.

Maybe I feel like saying that it is a lack of respect. But I feel it, No? I believe that behind every suicide attack there is something unbalanced, a lack of human equilibrium. I’m not sure if it is mental, but it human., something that is wrong with that person, who does not have true equilibrium regarding the meaning of his own life and that of others. He fights. He gives his life but he doesn’t give it in a good way. Many people, many people who work… think of the missionaries for example, who give their lives, but to build. Here they give their life destroying themselves and to destroy. There is something not right here. No? I accompanied an Alitalia pilot for his license, not doctoral thesis, in sociology on the Japanese kamikaze and I heard something from him. But it is difficult to understand this. I checked the part about methodology, but one could not understand it. But it is not something of the Orient only. There is research under way about a proposal that came in Italy during the Second World War, it came to Fascism in Italy. The proofs are not there, but there are indications. It is something that is very linked to dictatorial, totalitarian systems. They are closely linked, the totalitarian system if it does not take life, it kills possibilities, it kills the future, and it kills life too. But it’s not a problem that has ended, and it is not just Oriental. I don’t want to say more.

As for the use of children, this should be said in general, let’s talk about children. Children are exploited everywhere for many things, exploited for work, exploited also sexually. Some years ago with some senators in Argentina we wanted to make a campaign in the more important hotels to say publicly that children are not to be exploited for the tourists, but we were not able to do so. There are hidden resistances. I don’t know if they exploited them or not, it was a preventative measure. Then sometimes when I was in Germany I came across some papers where there were advertisements for sexual tourism, tourism in that area of south-east Asia, erotic tourism and there were children (included) in this. Children are exploited, the slave labor of children is terrible, and they are used for suicide (bombings too) too. I can’t say more.

Thanks Holy Father, and now we give the floor to Ignatio Ingrao for the Italian group.

Ingrao: Good day, I am for the weekly Panorama and Mio Papa. Your Holiness, there is much worry around the world for your security. According to Israeli and American security services the Vatican is in the sights of the Islamic Fundamentalists who want to fly the black flag on St Peter’s. According to them there is concern for your security when you go abroad. You’ve made clear that you don't want to lose contact with the people. But at this point, is it not necessary to change something in your behavior, in your program? There is also fear for the faithful who participate in your celebrations in the case of attacks. Are you worried about this? And more in general, what in your view is the best way to respond to this threat from the Islamic terrorists?

Pope: The best way to respond is always with meekness -- meek, to be humble. Like bread, no? Without making aggression. But there are people who do not understand this. As for the worry about the faithful, I am worried about this truly. They worry me. On this, I have spoken with Vatican security, who are charged with solving this. On the plane there is (Dr.) Gianni, the person who is responsible for security, and he updates me on this matter. This worries me, no? It worries me enough. I have fear but I have in fact a good dose of unawareness. I am unaware of these things.

Sometimes, I have asked myself the question and I have said to the Lord, 'I only want to ask you one grace.' Don't make me hurt, because I am not courageous in front of pain. I am very, very fearful (of physical pain), but I am in the hands of God.... But I know that they take security measures that are prudent, but secure. Then, we will see.

Lombardi: Thanks Holy Father. Let’s hope that we too can also have that same serenity! The next question comes from Christian Schmidt for the German Group and then Sebastian Maillard from La Croix for the French group, and then well’s see if you still want to continue or whether we stop.

Schmidt: Good day Holy Father! Could you tell us about your visit to the Buddhist temple yesterday which was a great surprise. What was your motivation for such a spontaneous visit? What do you say of the inspiration of this religion? We know that Christian missionaries were convinced, right up to the 20^th century, that Buddhism is a swindle and a religion of the devil. And, a third point: what could be the relevance of Buddhism for the future of Asia?

Pope: You asked why the visit, why did I go? The head of this temple had been able to get himself invited by the government to be at the airport (for my arrival). He’s a very good friend of Cardinal Ranjith, and there he met me and asked me to come to the temple, and Cardinal Ranjith said he’d get me there. Then, talking with the cardinal (I saw) there was not much time. When I arrive I had to suspend the meeting with the bishops because I wasn’t feeling well, I was tired, after the 29km of greeting the people (from the airport to the city) I was like a rag. Then returning (to Colombo) after Madhu there was the possibility of doing it, so we telephoned and we went there. In this temple there are relics of two disciples of the Buddha that for them are very important. These relics were in England and they managed to get them there, and they took them out so we could look at them. He came to see me at the airport, I went to see him at his house.

Second … yesterday I saw something I never thought I’d see … at the shrine of the Madonna, it wasn’t just Catholics, they weren’t even the majority. There were Buddhists, Muslims Hindus. They all go there to pray, and they say they receive graces. There’s something in the people there that unites them. If they are so naturally united that they come together to pray in that holy place, that is Christian, then how could I not go to Buddhist temple to greet them. This witness at Madhu yesterday was very important, it makes us understand the sense of inter-religiosity that is lived in Sri Lanka. There is respect among them, Yes, there are small fundamentalist groups, but they are not of the people, they are ideological elites. They are not of the people .

As far as [Buddhists] going to Hell …but also the Protestants when I was a child, in that time, 70 years ago, all the Protestants were going to hell, all of them. That’s what was said. Do you know what was the first experience I had of ecumenism? I told it to some days ago when I met a group from the Salvation Army. When I was four or five years old walking down the street with my grandmother, I saw two women from the Salvation Army, wearing those old-style hats, and I asked my grandmother, “Tell me, are they sisters (nuns)?” My Grandmother said “No, they are Protestant but they’re good (people).” It was the first time that I heard a person speaking well of people of another religion. At that time in the catechesis they told us that they all went to hell. I believe the church has grown a lot in its consciousness (understanding) and in its respect (for other religions), as I said in the interreligious encounter in Colombo the other day, when we read what the Second Vatican Council about the other religions, and the values in other religions. The Church has grown a lot in these years and in respect. There have been dark periods in the history of the Cchurch too, and we have to say that with shame. We’re all on a path of conversion, which is a grace; always from sin to grace. This inter-religiosity as brothers, respecting each other always is a grace.

Lombardi: Sebastian Maillard from La Croix for the French group.

Maillard: Holy Father, yesterday at mass you spoke about religious freedom as a fundamental human right. But in the respect for the different religions, up to what point can one go in freedom of expression? That too is a fundamental human right.

Pope. Thanks for the question, it’s an intelligent one. I believe that both are fundamental human rights, religious liberty and liberty of expression. One cannot -- but let’s think -- you are French? Let’s go to Paris, let’s speak clearly. One cannot hide a truth: everyone has the right to practice one’s religion, one’s own religion without giving offense. Freely. That’s how we do it, we want everyone to do that. Second: One cannot offend, make war, kill in the name of one’s own religion, that is, in the name of God. To us, that which happens now, it stuns us. But let’s think about our own history: how many wars of religion have we had? You may think of the night of St. Bartholomew; how can this be understood? We too were sinners in this. But one cannot kill in the name of God. This is an aberration. To kill in the name of God is an aberration. I believe that this is the principal point in terms of religious liberty. One has freedom in this, but without imposing or killing in the name of religion.

As for freedom of expression: each one not only has the freedom, the right but also the obligation to say what one thinks to help the common good. The obligation! Let’s think, if a member of parliament or a senator doesn’t say what he thinks is the right path then he does not collaborate for the common good. Not only these, but many others too. We have the obligation to say openly, to have this liberty, but without giving offense, because it is true, one cannot react violently. But if Dr. Gasbarri (the papal trip organizer who was standing beside him), a great friend, says a bad word against my mother, then a punch awaits him. But it’s normal, it’s normal. One cannot provoke, one cannot insult other people’s faith, one cannot make fun of faith. Pope Benedict in a speech, I don’t remember exactly where, he spoke of this post-positivist mentality, of post-positivist metaphysics, that led to the belief that in the end religions, religious expressions, are a kind of subculture, which are tolerated but are of little value, are not on the Enlightenment culture. And this is part of the heritage of the Enlightenment. And so many people who speak badly about other religions, or religions [in general], they make fun of, let’s say toy with [make into toys] other people’s religions, these people provoke and there can occur what would happen to Dr. Gasbarri if he said something against my mother. That is, there is a limit. Every religion has dignity; every religion that respects life, human life, the human person. And I cannot make fun of it. This is a limit and I have taken this sense of limit to say that in freedom of expression there are limits, like that in regard to my mom. I don’t know if I have managed to answer the question.

Lombardi: Thanks Holy Father. We’ve now been more than half an hour here, and we said we could stop when you are a little tired. You want us to continue some more, all right. But you tell us when you want to stop. The next in line is Joshua McElwee of the National Catholic Reporter.

McElwee: Thank you again Holy Father for the time. You have spoken many times against religious extremism. Do you have some concrete idea for how to involve other religious leaders to combat this problem, maybe a meeting in Assisi like Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI had?

Pope: Thank you. This proposal has already been made. I know that some are working on this. And I have spoken with Cardinal Tauran, who is in the inter-religious dialogue, and he has heard about this. I know that the uneasiness has not come from us, it has come from other religions in the area. I don't know how if there’s something involving organization, but there’s something in the air.

Lombardi: A final question and it comes from the Filipino group. We have Lynda Abalos who will ask something, and then we’ll leave the Pope at peace.

Abalos: Good day, Holy Father! I am sorry but my Italian is not very good.

Pope: Nor is mine!

Abalos: Holy Father, you have called for truth and reconciliation in Sri Lanka. I would like do you support a commission for truth and reconciliation in Sri Lanka and also in other places?

Pope: I don’t know how these commissions are. I know the one in Argentina in its time, after the military dictatorship and I supported that one, it was the right path. I can’t speak in the concrete [about other commissions], but I support the efforts to find the truth, but not as a vendetta, but to help to reach an agreement.

Maybe I will say something that I heard from the President of Sri Lanka. Now, I don’t want this to be interpreted as a political comment, but I heard something from the President of Sri Lanka, and I’ll just repeat what I heard as something phenomenological. I will just repeat what I heard, and which I agree with. He said he wants to move ahead with the work of peace – first word, and reconciliation. Then he used another word, he said we must create harmony in the people. Harmony is something more than peace, more than reconciliation, and it’s still more beautiful …that’s musical, too. Then he used another word. He said this harmony will give us happiness and joy. I was amazed. I said I like hearing this, but it’s not easy. Fifth word: he said yes, we must reach the heart of the people. And that last word is so profound that I thought of it to respond to your question. Just to reach the heart of the people, to know what is suffering, to know what is injustice, to know what it is to suffer from war, and so many other things. Just to arrive there, because the people knows about pardon; to arrive there so that we can find the right path without compromises that are not just, so that we can go forward. The commissions, investigations for the truth, are one of the elements that can help. I think of the case of Argentina. But they are only one of the elements, but there are others that we can do because we have to arrive at peace, reconciliation, harmony, felicity and joy but we have to reach the heart of the people. That’s what I thought of saying, but using the words of the president.